Talk:Chara/@comment-35274572-20180525000303/@comment-35700847-20180603102955
@Halibee Reminder that I responded to correct your assumption. I wouldn't have to repeat the reset question if you answered my question the first time. Also this is comment section is open to the public, nothing told me I couldn't correct you, so I did. Don't try to act like Mr.Innocent either by saying "I was looking for a friendly debate!" I brought up my point and you brought up yours then you started throwing personal insults at me because you couldn't actually debunk how I called Flowey's speech an assumption. You're the one who tried to tell me "Flowey is techincally talking to the player." It wasn't even actually a valid point, how is you trying to throw out that Flowey is "technically" talking to the "player" a valid point when we obviously know they aren't. You yourself even said at the end of your response that just because you brought up the point doesn't mean you believe it, so why bring in a point that you don't believe in up in the first place? Because some other people believe in it? We're both trying to prove our points here, not "some other people." or "some other people's" points. That would have only made sense if I believed it and brought it up or you believed it and brought it up, or you were assuming I believed it. Unless you just brought it up for no exact reason which is what I'm starting to believe. Also you shouldn't be talking about repeating twice, you brought up "Chara killed their family which proves their evil" twice even though it only applies to genocide and I agree they that are evil in genocide. "What I said was silly? What do you call what you're saying? If Chara already had the ability to RESET, then why didn't they take over during the end of the True Pacifist route? If they're so powerful, then they wouldn't need Frisk, they could just use their DETERMINATION and use it however they pleased, they wouldn't need Frisk at all." I'm gonna assume you're talking about when I asked you if Frisk or Chara had the reset ability? Well I didn't say Chara did have it, I asked YOU if you think Frisk or Chara has it and I went from there. Unless you're talking about something soulles true pacifist related? I gave points, you just chose to ignore some of them because you couldn't debunk them. Like, for example, me calling Flowey's speech an assumption, or does that suddenly not exist? It is an assumption because he doesn't actually know Chara's true intentions. Your original counter to that was "Asriel knew Chara best so they would know!" when that's obviously not concrete enough because they really don't know Chara's true intentions by the end of the game. Your whole argument and response to the person you originally responded to was banking off of that speech which was weak to begin with, because they still don't actually know what Chara is thinking and took a swing at the dark. There's no real evidence he knew for a fact that Chara was up to something shady after people were living in peace. So why do you keep bringing up his speech as if it proves your point? It's literally just "Flowey thinks so, which means that must be it!" I said I agreed with you that Chara is evil in genocide which means I understand they are evil in genocide. Does that mean I agree with you on them being evil in Pacifist? No. But them being evil in genocide IS a part of your point, and that part of the point is something I agreed on. If your point is that they are evil in both routes and I agree to them being evil in one route then I clearly understand one half of what you are trying to say, it's the other part I disagree with. You're the one who started saying "Oh you're the type of person who always has to pity the bad guy, etc" when I clearly didn't say you have to pity or cry for Chara. Is it really that hard for you to understand that I agree with one-half of what you're saying but not the other? Also I agreed to that part specifically because in an earlier response you brought up how Chara had a good uprbringing and still kills their family as a reason why they are evil. That point only works for genocide because it only happens in the genocide route, so I can agree to that. I already stated a number of times that I agreed to them being evil in genocide, which, let me remind you because you might forget, is a part of your argument. "Let me say this in a way that you can understand: Undertale is a game, whatever route that we take, will be the end of that game. The True Pacifist route, for example, the end of that route is about Frisk freeing all of the monsters and either they live with Toriel or they "have places to go" as they said. Chara's actions at that point are left up to our interpretation, the same applies for when you go through the Pacifist route after you've completed the Genocide route. " Hey, you brought the the random player being a referenced entity into this for no real reason, not me. Anyway, yes this first part is obvious, moving on. Chara's actions at that point are left up to interpretation? Ok, so why even try to use Flowey's speech as evidence that Chara is evil if you believe that? To support your interpretation? Well it's a speech based on Flowey's assumption sooo... Here's a bit of a difference though, we know what Chara did in genocide(Kill all monsters) and since they took Frisk's soul AND you get the creepy laugh or red x's on faces depending on what you choose. We can basically tell what has happened here. But at the end of pacifist that Isn't as obvious. Flowey shows up and gives a speech but we know that the speech is based on what he thinks could possibly happen(ed), not what actually did happen(ed). He's assuming Chara will reset and has done so a lot of times already, but have they? Well, no. Not only that but we don't see any evidence suggesting Chara is looking for a way to reset. It's not like they've been trying to persuade Frisk this whole time, and Frisk is the one who has the final say at the end of the day. "Oh, and one last thing, the reason I brought up the whole point of views thing, was because that's how some people view the game, not because I believe it. Looks like you're not as understanding as you say you are, otherwise you wouldn't make me out to be an idiot who believes a headcanon, instead of a person who simply likes her characters. Some understanding person." Well if you're trying to say that you don't believe and I didn't make any mention of it to back up my points previously(You can tell now that I don't believe it), why mention it at all? Not only that but me making you out to be an idiot with a headcanon is what happens when you randomly bring in a headcanon that didn't need to be mentioned at all. You just told me what you were trying to get across before up above without even mentioning the player so it's not like you had to mention them to get your point across. I said I was more understanding than you, which is true I agreed with one of your points. Maybe next time don't bring up a random headcanon for no reason?